Discussion with Nick Cutelli

TR: All right, Nick, thanks for joining me. If you wouldn't mind, I would love to hear about what initially drew you to a career in entertainment.

NC: At a young age I was pulled in, like elementary school wise, because I grew up during the 90s, like SNL age and my parents were huge fans of the show. They don't work in entertainment at all, but they used to watch all the time and I was big fan of Phil Hartman. For some reason, out of all the people Phil Hartman was my favorite. And that's kind of what drew me into wanting to do comedy. And then I started doing it kind of more and more at school. And I did community theater and stuff like that as a kid. I wasn't a child actor, thank God, but I did community theater. And then I did theater in middle school. And then I didn't do anything in high school. I think I auditioned for one show in high school and I didn't get it. And then I just like took a break from it. And then I didn't get back into it until college. But originally what drew me in was probably watching Saturday Night Live. I just watched a lot of TV.  I'll be one to admit it, I loved TV as a kid.

TR: I know you're a jack of all trades, you're involved with writing, acting, podcasting. Did one of those catch your attention first? Did you dive into one of those avenues first?

NC: I had this small period of time when I was in college, and I was like, well, I don't know what I'm supposed to do.  I was in a fraternity though, and they made me perform in the Greek week sketch. I remember I did it and I loved it. I won an award for best act, the stupidest award you could win, but I won it. And I remember that was the moment I was like, oh, man, I'd like to get back into being an actor because I miss this. And then that's when I had a meeting with the theater department in college and officially switched my major to a BFA in acting/directing. It just kind of took off from there in college. Starting out, they really pushed me to be a dramatic, musical theater, New York style actor. That was the program. You graduate here and you go to the East coast and it's all theater. So for a while, I was doing a lot of street theater and musical theater. When I graduated, I did a show on the East coast with Lynn Redgrave before she passed, and I was doing musical theater. Then I got my actors equity card and was doing professional theater. I was doing pretty much everything: professional theater, musical theater, kids theater, whatever I could get my hands on. Whatever paid me, you know, I was doing.

TR: Yeah, I mean, that's the route most people take out of school, though, finding the jobs that are willing to pay them. It's tough to sort of get your dream job right out of college.

NC: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I did that for a little bit and I like theater, but it's really exhausting though, because you're doing like nine shows a week. You got shows Tuesday through Sunday. You're only off on Mondays. On Saturdays and Sundays, you have to do two shows. You really don't have a life when you do a Broadway show or an off-Broadway show. I mean, that's it. That's your life for the next however long the show goes on. I also got really bored of doing the same show every night, and I'll admit that because it does get repetitive. Some actors can do that, like that's their comfort spot, but I always like to be creating stuff and doing new stuff.

I saved up enough money to move to Chicago in 2008, and then I strictly was on comedy because I knew I wanted to do the comedy route. I wanted to write it and perform it, and I did Second City and trained there. I did iO and all the improv theaters, and it was good. I learned a lot there and I performed a lot of sketch comedy, a lot of improv. Some was really good material and some was bad material, but it was a good experience. I did some commercial work in the Midwest. Mostly local regional commercials like Bill’s Matress House or something. And then I was a house team member at Second City Chicago for a little bit, too, and that was fun. And then I did the sketch fests and everything, so I kind of just did it all. Eventually I kind of just hit the ceiling because when you do Second City, you know, the main goal is to do this and then go to New York.

TR: Is the move then to try and get on to SNL? I know Second City is known as one of the best improv spots in the country and past cast members have come from there.

NC: Yeah. And they really do sell it hard because they want to get your money and they want you to be a student. It’s good though because I did learn a lot there, and I got really close to the mainstage kind of situation. I made it through all the rounds of the auditions and then they just didn't pick me. It's like being a baseball player and sitting in triple-A and they're just not going to call you up. I think that's when I figured out that I probably had hit the roof, and then that's when I started to take my attention to the West coast because all the work is in the West coast.

TR: That's why I moved out here. I was originally based in New York and then moved out to Los Angeles for that exact reason.

NC: Yeah. I love New York. New York is great, don't get me wrong.  But yeah, I moved out west and just started really working and developing how to sell myself. I think that's something a lot of actors forget when they come out to L.A. is that you can't think of yourself as just an actor.  You can’t think I'll just get an agent and audition, and then magic will happen. In my mindset, you have to think of yourself as a small business, you know, creating content. I have to network with people. I have to sell myself. That was my plan. To get my reel looking good, get updated headshots, and just start submitting through Actors Access. I think that's another big thing that actors don't realize is that in those first couple of years, you don't need an agent because we live in this Internet age where you can just subscribe to casting websites and self-submit yourself. I have an agent now and everything, and it's great, but I'll occasionally still self-submit myself to projects.

TR: Do you give your agent a heads up when you submit for roles on your own?

NC: Yeah. If it works out, I'll let them know. Here's the way I see it. I think for a lot of people the misconception when it comes to agents is that they are going to do everything for you. But your agent also probably reps hundreds of other people. You know people think it’s like Entourage, going to lunch in Beverly Hills with your agent. It's not like that, they don’t have the time for you. Nor do you want your agent to do that though, it's a professional relationship. So I'll self-submit, and I’ll do a lot of my own hustle because it also shows that I'm hustling for him, which isn't a bad thing. I'm out there to work and grind, and I think a lot of agents want that. They don't want the actor that just sits back and auditions. I think a lot of agents now want an actor who is always selling themselves.

TR: On that note, does your agent work on your behalf of all your creative endeavors? You’ve shared a script with me before, I know you're into screenwriting, and I know that you have your podcast going on as well. Do you work with your agent on all those endeavors, or does he strictly focus on acting for you?

NC: It's just strictly acting with him, and I like it that way. My agent strictly just focuses on the acting and commercial aspect of stuff.

It's very hard to break in when it comes to representation for Lit. I think that's why the goal is to create and get your stuff produced. I always tell a lot of writers you can't just write stuff and send it out because agents aren't going to sit down and say, “Okay Nick just sent me a script, let me read it even though I've never worked with this guy in my life.” If I send them a YouTube clip though of a 5-8 minute short that I wrote and it looks good, I think that'll get their attention. And that's kind of what you want to do as a writer is to get your stuff produced, and then that's your reel that you can use to get the attention of a lit manager or a lit agent.

TR: So what are the primary methods right now that you're using to promote yourself?

NC: I do a lot of LinkedIn, I do a lot of LinkedIn stuff connecting with people. That's what I think I connected with you on.

TR: Yeah, it is. I think that's an interesting avenue. I would love to hear more about your thoughts around it, because in my experience I don't think many people in the entertainment business necessarily use LinkedIn.  I feel as though creatives aren't using LinkedIn as much because it’s more of a business-oriented platform.

NC: Yeah. You got to remember that even as an artist, there's a business to it. You have to think in a business mindset. I know a lot of people use IMDB Pro and then find emails of people and cold email like crazy, which sometimes can work, but IMDb Pro isn't always the most updated site. Whereas with LinkedIn, I feel like you find people easily and they're a little bit more open to accepting emails and communication. That’s usually how I do it. I'll connect with people on LinkedIn, and I won't make that rookie mistake of instantly trying to pitch them something. Nowadays I connect with someone, make an introduction and then I just ask what they're working on, what they’re looking for or ask permission to send them something. Sometimes they flat out say no. Sometimes they'll say send me a logline or a one-page treatment. I think a rookie mistake is sending the script out versus sending the log. If you have a really good log, then they're going to say send me the one page and then send me script. I've gotten emails where people will just send me the script, but I'm not going to read it. You need to tell me in two sentences what the whole thing is about.

TR: So go for more of a soft introduction to the project itself at first.

NC: Yeah. I also get logs where it’s a paragraph. You should be able to just sum it up in two sentences. This is why it's interesting. Here's the story. If you can't condense it down into two or three sentences, then I don't feel like you have a good grip on your story. I think the other rookie mistake is that people will send twenty different logs. They'll go here are my fifteen logs for movie scripts and pilots. My advice is have one or two and that is what you focus on. That is what you're pitching. That is what you're sending out. The big mistake is thinking I’m going to create all this content, and then I'll just send it to a Lit manager and let them read over my twenty logs. It just comes across as very unfocused. If you just send them one log, they're not going to think this guy's only got one script.

TR: Yeah, I think that's a very valid point.

NC: Yeah, if they like the log, they'll open the door for you. They might say it's a good log, I'm not really looking for this, but feel free to send me more stuff if you've got it. And then you might wait a little bit, like a week or two, and then send them another log and just keep that relationship going.

TR: So on this note then of reaching out, do you any advice for somebody when they're looking to get a start in this industry and to get their foot in the door? Any general advice?

NC: Yeah. I'll go from the actor’s perspective first. I think from the actor’s perspective there’s a couple of things to remember. Number one, you have to get some training. A lot of people come out to L.A. and they've never taken an acting class or they didn't go to college to be an actor. They just think that you show up. As an actor, you have to have some training and a little bit of a resume. I feel like each major city in America has some sort of studio scene or theatrical scene or something, so don't come to L.A. and not have a resume. Come here and be prepared and know the industry. A lot of the time actors will come here and get eaten up, chewed up and spit out within a month because they just they just don't know what they're doing. So really research the business aspect of being an actor. The sad thing is that there's a lot of shady stuff in Los Angeles that will take advantage of newbie actors, which is really a shame. People can say take my class and you'll be a star by the end of the week or give me all this money and I'll introduce you to this person and blah, blah, blah. You really have to be self-aware not to buy into it. I think the other thing for an actor, too, is don’t get sucked into thinking that you have to network through partying in clubs. I always hear that a lot.

TR: That's a piece I've heard as well, to not get sucked into the party scene too much.

NC: Yeah, yeah. I've heard the horror stories. I think the best way to network as an actor is, number one, have all your materials. Have a reel, have your headshot, have some sort of resume, have something, have a website, and then you want to focus. I would say focus on small projects that you have a good chance of getting like small commercials that might pay you 50 bucks or a hundred bucks. Or student films from USC or UCLA where they look really good. When you work with those people on set, that's your networking right there. If you hit it off with them, they'll probably keep you in mind for future stuff. If you're just a nice person, you show up on time, you memorize your lines, you're prepared, you're polite to everybody on set, you'll go a long way. I know some actors who are really talented, but I would never hire them because they'll show up late. To recap, I think commercials are the best route into the industry.

TR: I have two more questions for you before we wrap up here. Do you have any experience with mentorships in your career? Do you have any advice for young actors, young writers, young producers looking to get a mentor to help them?

NC: I had a mentor when I was in college. He was one of my professors. He was great. I learned a lot from him. I think he really helped me develop. I think he also helped me with confidence, being able to handle criticism, working through failure, things like that. I personally mentor, and I usually help out a lot of people that are in my college. Mainly students that are in the theater department at my college. If they want to come to L.A., I usually mentor them. I kind of teach them what we just talked about. The steps, what to avoid, what you need to do, the reality of Hollywood. And so, I usually mentor seniors in college who want to come to LA. I would say the best way though is to start out networking on LinkedIn. If you trained in college, look up alumni from your college that live in California. Just start connecting with them and then start asking them questions. Say I'm also a graduate from here and I see you work in film and I'm working to be a writer, do you have any advice for me. The rookie thing I see is someone saying, “Hey, I went to your college. I'm an alumnus too. Here's my resume. Can you send it out to all these people and help me?” And I'm like, I'm not going to do that because, I don't know you.

TR: You haven't even had a conversation.

NC: Yeah, yeah. I really think a good start though is connecting with alumni from your college. I think it’s the best route. That's kind of how I got my first agent in Los Angeles. I connected with an alumnus that works in entertainment, and we talked for a little bit. I slid the question in there and asked him if he knew of any representation, and that's how I got my first official agent in LA. And when it comes to a mentoring standpoint, I would say just let the mentorship develop organically and naturally. I think that's kind of where a talent manager comes into play. Talent managers are more of the mentor. You know, if you're a writer and actor and you have a talent manager, that's where you can kind of have more of a personal relationship. Versus when you have an agent, you really don't have a personal relationship with them. It’s just a business relationship. The talent manager is someone that's going to be kind of your mentor.

TR: Would you advise trying to get a talent manager before a talent agent?

NC: That's a weird question, and I get that question a lot. It's kind of like a chicken or the egg thing. Talent managers can help you get an agent, but agents will not help you get a talent manager because a lot of agents just don't like to deal with talent managers because talent managers speak for the actor. They can be a little bit more aggressive. And you have to remember talent managers aren't regulated like agents. You know, agents have to have a license and all of these things. Whereas I could become a talent manager by the end of this sentence. But it's interesting to me because I tried to work with the talent manager for a little bit and he was a nice guy. It just didn't work out. I didn't think he was really helping me. I was making more doors open for me than he was. But it's interesting because I know some people who strictly will just work with the talent manager and it works for them. And then I know some people who will only work with a talent manager when their career gets to that point that they need one.

I really think when it comes to representation, focus on a commercial agent. Don't worry about managers. Don't worry about theatrical agents. As an actor, focus on getting a commercial agent. Number one, they're always looking for new people. Number two, you don't have to have a huge resume to get their attention. You just have to have a decent reel, good headshot, and have your stuff together, because commercial agents are always looking for new people. A lot of actors don't think about that though. They always think to get a theatrical agent to get film spots, but a lot of the good theatrical agents will have nothing to do with you because you just don't have the resume. And if you do get a theatrical agent and you don't have the resume, then that kind of draws a red flag to me. The thing I see that happens is the actor doesn't know any better and they’ll make you sign a contract for like two years. And then you're locked in with a shitty agent for years. But back to it, commercial agents are the route to go. Commercials pay more. I love doing commercials because they pay a lot more versus if I do one day of TV or something. You might book one good commercial, and you might not have to work again for six months or the year.

TR: I think we'll wrap up then with one final question. Are there any trends in entertainment that have caught your eye or ones you're following moving forward?

NC: It's a good thing of how entertainment has evolved now, because obviously there's a lot of content. There's not a monopoly on the content. You know, it used to be we had the five networks, and they pretty much made all the TV shows. But now you've got so many production companies. It's cheap to make content. It's easy to make a TV show. You know, if you can produce your own TV show and you have nine episodes of it, you've got a good chance of selling it to Hulu or Netflix, and everybody's trying to get into the content game now. Facebook has content, Snapchat is making content. So there's a lot of work out there that's happening, which is really good. I think the hot thing right now is podcasting, and I think that's due to COVID. I don't know what's going to happen once COVID is officially gone. The podcast market might burst kind of like the tech bubble burst in the early 2000s. But podcasting is really huge right now. I know they're trying to get a lot of podcasts turned into TV shows and things like that. I think another trend is adapting books and comic books into movies. Everything old is new again. I think it’s starting to kind of peak. I'm hoping that we kind of get out of that because I think the big issue in Hollywood right now is people are scared to invest in new stuff. They want the sure thing.

TR: Yeah, to know that it works.

NC: Yeah. Stuff will get rebooted and I'll watch it over. I'm going to watch this because I'm seeing an old show from the 90s and now it's back. But then after you watch the first two episodes, you’ve quenched your nostalgia thirst. So I hope that Hollywood gets back on track to taking more risks and chances when it comes to original content, because we saw a lot of that in the 80s, in the 90s, and the 2000s. So I'm hoping that Hollywood gets back on track to taking more risks.

TR: Well, I appreciate you taking the time, Nick. This has been great.

NC: Thank you so much.

Follow Nick Cutelli on his Personal Website